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**Cha** · 09-15-2011, 02:00 AM

"Harvard's Randall Kennedy used the TV host's show to debunk his rants about Obama."

Quote:Bristling in the face of the calm scholar, Tavis Smiley was having none of the lesson that Randall Kennedy was teaching on Smiley's TV show in early September. So the Harvard law professor contented himself with taking PBS viewers to school on the complex relationship between the first black U.S. president and his African-American constituency.

Kennedy weighed in with the scholarship of his new book, The Persistence of the Color Line: Racial Politics and the Obama Presidency, noting that President Barack Obama has mastered the dual audience so troubling to black seekers of high office. African-American voters broke for him in the '08 primary after largely white voters in Iowa favored him over John Edwards and Hillary Clinton.

Quote:A roundly unimpressed Smiley laid down the gauntlet to "respect, protect and correct" the sitting U.S. president, with tongue-lashing emphasis on "ko-reck." After resisting every nudge for reason and restraint during Kennedy's 26-minute clinic on the Obama presidency, the host offered the professor no choice but to flunk him respectfully as a cocksure student dead wrong on every key question.

Seldom has such baloney passed through the grinder with such melancholy ignorance.

Two pages of interesting analysis from Harvard Law Professor Randall Kennedy..
http://www.theroot.com/views/professor-w...vis-smiley

**nofurylike** · 09-15-2011, 02:22 AM

that is a great analysis! and a great story of Kennedy and Smiley!

thank you so much for posting that, Cha!

**nofurylike** · 09-15-2011, 02:37 AM

http://www.reddit.com/r/reddit.com/comme...is_smiley/

thank you!

**Cha** · 09-15-2011, 01:30 PM

(09-15-2011 02:37 AM)nofurylike Wrote: http://www.reddit.com/r/reddit.com/comme...is_smiley/

thank you!

Thank you for the reddit, fury! I told the person whose link is was on POU that this needs to go Viral. Wave

**nofurylike** · 09-16-2011, 01:37 AM

(09-15-2011 01:30 PM)Cha Wrote:
(09-15-2011 02:37 AM)nofurylike Wrote: http://www.reddit.com/r/reddit.com/comme...is_smiley/

thank you!
Thank you for the reddit, fury! I told the person whose link is was on POU that this needs to go Viral.

that's great! i agree it needs to go Viral, Cha!!

thank you! Wave

**Brainwreck** · 09-15-2011, 06:44 AM

Thank you, Law professor Kennedy. Smiley needed a bit of slapping down. And thank you Cha for posting this.

**Peacetrain** · 09-15-2011, 08:40 AM

I used to love Tavis Smiley.. but when he got his knickers in a twist over the President not coming to his conference because of previous scheduling..and Michelle Obama was going to go, and Tavis De-invited her.. well let me just say this about that.

pffffffffftttttttttttttt

**Willinois** · (This post was last modified: 09-15-2011 09:11 AM by Willinois.)

I'm really amazed that Smiley gets away with having such a condescending attitude about black voters. This line stuck out for me...

"Hillary was still ahead of him 2- or 3-to-1 in most polls, until the overwhelming numbers of white voters in Iowa gave him that victory and then said it was OK. What [does] it [say] about black folk along that color line that they didn't break for Barack Obama until white folk essentially -- my words, not yours -- gave them permission?"

White voters gave permission? Come on! I knocked on doors in five primary states for Obama including Iowa. I talked to enough black voters that I saw what happened and Smiley is dead wrong.

It was easy to see a dramatic shift after Iowa. Black voters were amazed that a 98% white state voted for a black candidate. It signaled that Obama wasn't going to be another Al Sharpton or even Jesse Jackson who would get votes among mostly African-American voters before losing the nomination. They saw that Obama was electable. Obama proved to black voters that his campaign wasn't going to be a wasted effort. They liked Obama better than Clinton all along but he had to prove himself first. It was a politically savvy judgement that wasn't "tribal" and it wasn't about seeking permission. It proved that black voters will make up their own minds even when many established leaders were still backing Clinton.

I knocked on enough doors in African-American neighborhoods that it was easy to see opinions change after Iowa because voters told me why they switched from Clinton. Maybe if Smiley had been on the ground he wouldn't be so out of touch with the average black voter. Honestly, if Rush Limbaugh had said the same patronizing things about black voters that Smiley said I would call it racist.

**Cha** · 09-15-2011, 01:28 PM

(09-15-2011 09:01 AM)Willinois Wrote: I'm really amazed that Smiley gets away with having such a condescending attitude about black voters. This line stuck out for me...

"Hillary was still ahead of him 2- or 3-to-1 in most polls, until the overwhelming numbers of white voters in Iowa gave him that victory and then said it was OK. What [does] it [say] about black folk along that color line that they didn't break for Barack Obama until white folk essentially -- my words, not yours -- gave them permission?"

White voters gave permission? Come on! I knocked on doors in five primary states for Obama including Iowa. I talked to enough black voters that I saw what happened and Smiley is dead wrong.

It was easy to see a dramatic shift after Iowa. Black voters were amazed that a 98% white state voted for a black candidate. It signaled that Obama wasn't going to be another Al Sharpton or even Jesse Jackson who would get votes among mostly African-American voters before losing the nomination. They saw that Obama was electable. Obama proved to black voters that his campaign wasn't going to be a wasted effort. They liked Obama better than Clinton all along but he had to prove himself first. It was a politically savvy judgement that wasn't "tribal" and it wasn't about seeking permission. It proved that black voters will make up their own minds even when many established leaders were still backing Clinton.

I knocked on enough doors in African-American neighborhoods that it was easy to see opinions change after Iowa because voters told me why they switched from Clinton. Maybe if Smiley had been on the ground he wouldn't be so out of touch with the average black voter. Honestly, if Rush Limbaugh had said the same patronizing things about black voters that Smiley said I would call it racist.

Thanks for your experience with this, Will. It was an amazing phenomenon..Iowa was the key to unlocking the door! I'm glad to say that even though it took me a while to settle on a candidate that I sent money to the Obama Campaign right before Iowa and then when he won..I went to work the next morning and told the first person I saw.."Obama won Iowa!"

"Adrift now among their brethren, with scars to show for it, Smiley and these diehard Clinton loyalists seem vested not so much in trumpeting Obama successes as they are in whooping about failures in order to redeem themselves with "I-told-you-so's."

Tavis is making himself look smaller and smaller.

**Willinois** · (This post was last modified: 09-15-2011 01:32 PM by Willinois.)

(09-15-2011 01:28 PM)Cha Wrote: "Adrift now among their brethren, with scars to show for it, Smiley and these diehard Clinton loyalists seem vested not so much in trumpeting Obama successes as they are in whooping about failures in order to redeem themselves with "I-told-you-so's."

Tavis is making himself look smaller and smaller.

Yes, along with the Naderites who take every chance to pounce on failure and ignore successes. They want to be proven right. It's about their own ego.

**Cha** · 09-15-2011, 01:43 PM

(09-15-2011 01:32 PM)Willinois Wrote:
(09-15-2011 01:28 PM)Cha Wrote: "Adrift now among their brethren, with scars to show for it, Smiley and these diehard Clinton loyalists seem vested not so much in trumpeting Obama successes as they are in whooping about failures in order to redeem themselves with "I-told-you-so's."

Tavis is making himself look smaller and smaller.

Yes, along with the Naderites who take every chance to pounce on failure and ignore successes. They want to be proven right. It's about their own ego.

So many insecure egos hurting our future as a Nation. It's all about them..they wouldn't know how to successfully run a country. Revenge is their impetus.

Thank Goodness for Prof Randall Kennedy! I'd like to buy his book.

**Number23** · 09-15-2011, 11:35 PM

(09-15-2011 09:01 AM)Willinois Wrote: I'm really amazed that Smiley gets away with having such a condescending attitude about black voters. This line stuck out for me...

"Hillary was still ahead of him 2- or 3-to-1 in most polls, until the overwhelming numbers of white voters in Iowa gave him that victory and then said it was OK. What [does] it [say] about black folk along that color line that they didn't break for Barack Obama until white folk essentially -- my words, not yours -- gave them permission?"

White voters gave permission? Come on! I knocked on doors in five primary states for Obama including Iowa. I talked to enough black voters that I saw what happened and Smiley is dead wrong.

It was easy to see a dramatic shift after Iowa. Black voters were amazed that a 98% white state voted for a black candidate. It signaled that Obama wasn't going to be another Al Sharpton or even Jesse Jackson who would get votes among mostly African-American voters before losing the nomination. They saw that Obama was electable. Obama proved to black voters that his campaign wasn't going to be a wasted effort. They liked Obama better than Clinton all along but he had to prove himself first. It was a politically savvy judgement that wasn't "tribal" and it wasn't about seeking permission. It proved that black voters will make up their own minds even when many established leaders were still backing Clinton.

I knocked on enough doors in African-American neighborhoods that it was easy to see opinions change after Iowa because voters told me why they switched from Clinton. Maybe if Smiley had been on the ground he wouldn't be so out of touch with the average black voter. Honestly, if Rush Limbaugh had said the same patronizing things about black voters that Smiley said I would call it racist.

Wow. Great post, Willi! And I agree with every word!

**Ikonoklast** · 09-15-2011, 01:37 PM

Smiley and other Clinton dead-enders are just making themselves look petty and small...but Smiley as the self-anointed person who is the only one who knows the hearts and minds of Black voters, well, that Smiley is so disconnected from reality as to be delusional.

**RoyGBiv** · 09-21-2011, 08:10 AM

(09-15-2011 01:37 PM)Ikonoklast Wrote: Smiley and other Clinton dead-enders are just making themselves look petty and small...but Smiley as the self-anointed person who is the only one who knows the hearts and minds of Black voters, well, that Smiley is so disconnected from reality as to be delusional.

Small quibble with basically the same meaning ...

Smiley isn't so much a Clinton dead-ender as he is a Tavis Smiley dead-ended. Clinton is irrelevant to this. It's about Smiley's personal image and his ability to dictate the narrative. He along with Cornell West are angry that Obama's election did not come with a rise in their personal status.

Within that narrow context, they aren't truly disconnected from reality. They and their narrative really aren't the dominant force behind Obama's presidency. Where they lose touch with reality is in believing they should be.

**nofurylike** · 09-21-2011, 09:24 AM

(09-21-2011 08:10 AM)RoyGBiv Wrote:
(09-15-2011 01:37 PM)Ikonoklast Wrote: Smiley and other Clinton dead-enders are just making themselves look petty and small...but Smiley as the self-anointed person who is the only one who knows the hearts and minds of Black voters, well, that Smiley is so disconnected from reality as to be delusional.

Small quibble with basically the same meaning ...

Smiley isn't so much a Clinton dead-ender as he is a Tavis Smiley dead-ended. Clinton is irrelevant to this. It's about Smiley's personal image and his ability to dictate the narrative. He along with Cornell West are angry that Obama's election did not come with a rise in their personal status.

Within that narrow context, they aren't truly disconnected from reality. They and their narrative really aren't the dominant force behind Obama's presidency. Where they lose touch with reality is in believing they should be.

very well said, Roy!!

"Where they lose touch with reality is in believing they should be."

**Ikonoklast** · 09-22-2011, 11:37 AM

(09-21-2011 08:10 AM)RoyGBiv Wrote:
(09-15-2011 01:37 PM)Ikonoklast Wrote: Smiley and other Clinton dead-enders are just making themselves look petty and small...but Smiley as the self-anointed person who is the only one who knows the hearts and minds of Black voters, well, that Smiley is so disconnected from reality as to be delusional.

Small quibble with basically the same meaning ...

Smiley isn't so much a Clinton dead-ender as he is a Tavis Smiley dead-ended. Clinton is irrelevant to this. It's about Smiley's personal image and his ability to dictate the narrative. He along with Cornell West are angry that Obama's election did not come with a rise in their personal status.

Within that narrow context, they aren't truly disconnected from reality. They and their narrative really aren't the dominant force behind Obama's presidency. Where they lose touch with reality is in believing they should be.

Valid point, indeed. Mr. Smiley's ego may have got the better of him in this case, as he seems to be wounded by the fact that he doesn't get to call the shots for this administration.

**RoyGBiv** · 09-22-2011, 12:10 PM

(09-22-2011 11:37 AM)Ikonoklast Wrote: Valid point, indeed. Mr. Smiley's ego may have got the better of him in this case, as he seems to be wounded by the fact that he doesn't get to call the shots for this administration.

The thing I have never understood -- about West or Smiley -- is what they think would be different under Clinton. Is the name just a tool they throw out there to try to pin some ill-defined measure of "better" on? Better how?

I don't necessarily think things would be worse under Clinton overall, nor any better. I doubt, in fact, they would be much different at all except for the form the criticism took.

**Ikonoklast** · 09-22-2011, 01:18 PM

(09-22-2011 12:10 PM)RoyGBiv Wrote:
(09-22-2011 11:37 AM)Ikonoklast Wrote: Valid point, indeed. Mr. Smiley's ego may have got the better of him in this case, as he seems to be wounded by the fact that he doesn't get to call the shots for this administration.

The thing I have never understood -- about West or Smiley -- is what they think would be different under Clinton. Is the name just a tool they throw out there to try to pin some ill-defined measure of "better" on? Better how?

I don't necessarily think things would be worse under Clinton overall, nor any better. I doubt, in fact, they would be much different at all except for the form the criticism took.

I never got that, either. For one thing, it's all pure speculation that is in no way proveable one way or another, and one cannot base any argument for or against this point on any type of factual evidence.

It's all opinion as to 'what might have been', and needs to be treated as exactly that.

I like Tavis, he's smart guy, and so is Dr. West, he does make forceful arguments for the causes he pushes for, but they both let vanity and emotions cloud their better judgment concerning PBO.

Just being Human, I guess.

I see them both coming around, to some degree, or at the least making peace with any issues that they may have with this president, and if not actually getting on board, at least toning down the rhetoric a little.

In the end, I think smart people will realize PBO is really on their side, after all.

**kahuna** · 09-24-2011, 01:24 PM

(09-21-2011 08:10 AM)RoyGBiv Wrote: He along with Cornell West are angry that Obama's election did not come with a rise in their personal status.

Within that narrow context, they aren't truly disconnected from reality. They and their narrative really aren't the dominant force behind Obama's presidency. Where they lose touch with reality is in believing they should be.

You nailed it, 100%. They don't want to recognize how irrelevant they are. Black leaders???? They never were, and they never will be. They need to acknowledge that and move along.

**Number23** · 09-15-2011, 07:28 PM

Cha, have I told you recently that I love you??

I am SO posting this on a certain black forum.

**Cha** · 09-15-2011, 08:37 PM

(09-15-2011 07:28 PM)Number23 Wrote: Cha, have I told you recently that I love you??

I am SO posting this on a certain black forum.

I felt like I hit paydirt! Love Ya

Number23~ Viral that baby!

I found it in the comments section of Pragmatic Obots Unite.

http://pragmaticobotsunite.blogspot.com/

Wave

**Hekate** · 09-21-2011, 01:03 AM

This is a great read, especially after seeing Prof. Cornel West interviewed by Martin Bashir today. I don't recall having seen West interviewed before, but I've heard his name often enough to kind of know who he is.

Good lord 'n' butter, as Opus used to say. It was like flipping on the ol' black and white cathode ray tube television set and finding it tuned to 1966. He called Mr. Bashir "Brother Martin" and he didn't so much speak as intone. And did he ever have a lot to intone about. Facepalm

West thinks Obama is without spine and needs to have a primary challenger to buck him up and teach him a lesson. Shocked

Right! Let's split the vote and do the usual Democratic thing: snatch defeat from the jaws of victory once again!

Bashir, for those who don't know, likes Obama. A lot. But he was no match for the all-knowing professor.

Just a thought here: when Cornel West was forming his philosophy and public persona, the current President of the US was barely in kindergarten. Professor West seems frozen in time. Professor Kennedy gets it.

The interview is here, part way down the page http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3096434/

**kahuna** · 09-21-2011, 07:16 AM

(09-21-2011 01:03 AM)Hekate Wrote: Just a thought here: when Cornel West was forming his philosophy and public persona, the current President of the US was barely in kindergarten. Professor West seems frozen in time. Professor Kennedy gets it.

West is definately frozen in time. I'm 57, and West sounds just like the campus activists I used to hear in the 60s and 70s. He is stuck in a time warp. That's why I don't ever listen to him. I've heard it all before....DECADES ago.

**Julie** · 09-21-2011, 08:08 AM

What a splendid read!