Hundreds Of Anti-war Activists Pledge To Help Elect Another Republican President –

[SeattleGirl]

So They Can Keep Their Jobs!
~Extreme Liberal's Blog~

Being a liberal is very frustrating most of the time. The main reason for my frustration is that our end of the political spectrum includes people who are so ideological and absolutist, that they lose sight of reality and wallow in their anger instead of participating and making a real difference. The reality of our 2 party system eludes these people, they tell themselves that if they attack both parties that somehow a perfect, utopian candidate will emerge and save us from those evil Democrats and Republicans. It hasn’t ever happened, even though these folks have been trying for over 30 years. You can’t have a rational conversation with them either, they simply won’t accept that it’s either the Democrats or the Republicans who call the shots, that’s it an either/or political environment, no matter how much the blogs make them feel like it isn’t. I think it would be awesome if we had a third, viable alternative to the two parties we currently have.

:snip:

I have to give the Tea Partiers credit for actually organizing at the district level, running candidates and building their movement from the ground up. Sure, they have a lot of support from the Koch brothers and others, but they are doing it at the district level and building their movement from the ground up. Do you see anything like that happening with the anti-war activists? I wish they would do more than just bitch and send around petitions, a lot of good all those petitions are doing in our two party system. Mobilize, run candidates in primaries or get off your asses and start a third party, run candidates, raise money and make a difference. But sitting on the sideline and purposely hurting the most liberal of the two parties is just stupid, short sighted and selfish.

:snip:

The story that prompted this rant is at The Raw Story, entitled “Hundreds of liberal activists pledge to oppose Obama in 2012” and the name of the link exaggerates a little more “prominent-liberals-pledge-oppose-obama-2012-supports-war.” Prominent? Really, I read the list of names and recognized like two of them, prominent?

:snip:

Someone explain to me how electing a Republican, the result of weakening the Democrat, is going to help their cause of stopping the wars. Do they think that a Republican president is going to be better. Have any of these people heard people like John Bolton calling for an attack on Iran? Have any of these people listened to the leaders in the Republican party who think we are in a holy war with Islam? Do they just not care? WTF, how can these people claim to care about innocent people when their actions will only serve to hurt more and more innocent people. I have to be cynical and suspect that they enjoy the fight, they probably even make money doing it. Why else would people who seem intelligent, completely ignore the consequences of their actions? To me it looks like they are willing to hurt people to further their cause. What makes these one-issue-voters any different than the abortion, one-issue-voters?

Link to entire piece: http://extremeliberal.wordpress.com/2011...heir-jobs/

People like those the Extreme Liberal is writing about are why I stopped reading a number of blogs and websites that I used to read religiously. They were fine when Bush was in office, but now, the caterwauling over, and hatred toward, Obama just nauseates me. Plus, it annoys the hell out of me to see supposed adults acting like their fantasy world is the real world and I'm the one who doesn't "get" it.

[KonaKane]

Sometimes I feel like I'm living in a Kafka novel, it's gotten so weird.

[SeattleGirl]

(02-03-2011 11:03 PM)KonaKane Wrote:  Sometimes I feel like I'm living in a Kafka novel, it's gotten so weird.

I thought things would get better under Obama, and in my world, they ARE getting better. But the clamor from those on the "left" is nearly unbearable. Kafka novel is right, Kona.

[RoyGBiv]

Welcome to America, where "activists" think joining a Facebook group is the pathway to revolution.

[SeattleGirl]

(02-03-2011 11:06 PM)RoyGBiv Wrote:  Welcome to America, where "activists" think joining a Facebook group is the pathway to revolution.

LOL, so true, Roy!

[mzmolly]

Quote:But sitting on the sideline and purposely hurting the most liberal of the two parties is just stupid, short sighted and selfish.

Agreed. Even the Tea Party fools are smart enough to run on the Republican ticket.

[Willinois]

I read the first part of the raw story blog this refers too.

Quote:Hundreds of liberal organizers and anti-war activists have signed a petition pledging to oppose President Barack Obama's renomination in 2012 unless he reverses course in Afghanistan and pushes for significant cuts to military spending.

"We vow not to support President Barack Obama for renomination for another term in office, and to actively seek to impede his war policies unless and until he reverses them," the petition reads.

Reverse his war policies? Which policies do they want him to reverse?
Ending combat operations in Iraq?
The $100 Billion in defense cuts Obama recently announced?
Refusing to deliver the kind of war-mongering speeches we heard from Bush?
Does it occur to them that the war in Afghanistan is "increasingly unpopular" because Obama doesn't cheerlead for it?
Do they want Obama to break his pledge to begin withdrawal from Afghanistan next year?

I guess what they want by "reversing course" is to send more troops back into Iraq, extend the Afghanistan occupation, spend more on defense, and start pounding the drums of war. That would be the reverse of what Obama is doing now. Obviously, we're dealing with people who don't deal in reality.

I was one of many anti-war activists who volunteered for Obama. I was hoping we'd get a President who at least listens and responds to the anti-war left. Someone who can be pressured to end the war sooner rather than later and not start new ones. That's what we got. That's the most I expect to get from anyone who's able to get a plurality of the votes in a Presidential election.

Later in the raw story blog David Swanson is quoted:
"We ought to think of this more in terms of pressuring elected officials to improve where they are, to move in the right direction."

Yes, we should pressure elected officials. That's why I continue to participate and help organize peace events in my town (in-person events with people who don't live in liberal enclaves).

But is this an effective form of pressure? It's an empty threat since there's little to no chance of Obama being beaten in the primary or by a third party candidate. What they're telling everyone is that they're willing to waste their own time on a symbolic gesture that will no doubt make them feel more self-righteous than backing Obama. And it might just help elect a Republican. That's not pressure. The only thing it will effectively accomplish is making them an object of ridicule.

No thanks, I'd rather accomplish something.

[SeattleGirl]

Willinois wrote:

"But is this an effective form of pressure? It's an empty threat since there's little to no chance of Obama being beaten in the primary or by a third party candidate. What they're telling everyone is that they're willing to waste their own time on a symbolic gesture that will no doubt make them feel more self-righteous than backing Obama. And it might just help elect a Republican. That's not pressure. The only thing it will effectively accomplish is making them an object of ridicule."

You are so right, Will. Just as the Republicans care only about winning, regardless of the cost to the rest of us, so those on the uber "left" care only about their self-righteousness, again regardless of the cost to the rest of us. I can really do without all of them!

[atomic]

That is the very definition of insanity. Oy.

[Tarheel_Dem]

It's pathetic, and smacks of desparation. Some of these anti-war "activists" built their careers (such as they were) opposing Bush on Iraq. With Iraq being removed from the headlines, they are groping for relevance in a post Bush era.

Mind you, many of these same folks contributed to Al Gore's loss, because he wasn't pure enough. I believe they are just as responsible for Iraq as Bush/Cheney (IMHO), and maybe even moreso, because they claim to be so much more intelligent than the rest of us.

[Willinois]

(02-03-2011 10:57 PM)Punky Wrote:  Prominent? Really, I read the list of names and recognized like two of them, prominent?

I recognize some of them as the same group who did such a great job of leading the anti-war movement during the Bush years. Mostly religious activists and Vietnam-protesting retreads who think they own the movement.

[RoyGBiv]

(02-04-2011 12:52 AM)Willinois Wrote:  I recognize some of them as the same group who did such a great job of leading the anti-war movement during the Bush years. Mostly religious activists and Vietnam-protesting retreads who think they own the movement.

There are an awful lot of people trying to relive the 60s ... or with some of them trying to have "a 60s experience" since they were pretty much unaware of what was going on at the time or watched it from the comfort of their living rooms.

And they're still trying to do it from their living rooms.

[nofurylike]

thank you for posting this, Punky!
there is much to be said about this, and it has been said very well throughout this thread, thank you all.

i just want to add that it is deeply moving to feel the understanding here on DFP. many of everyone's comments touched my own feelings about this. and this seems to encapsulate it all, so effectively:
the "hatred toward, Obama" - at the blogs i used to read - "just nauseates me. Plus, it annoys the hell out of me to see supposed adults acting like their fantasy world is the real world and I'm the one who doesn't 'get' it."

thank you, again.
all.

[SeattleGirl]

(02-04-2011 03:19 AM)nofurylike Wrote:  thank you for posting this, Punky!
there is much to be said about this, and it has been said very well throughout this thread, thank you all.

i just want to add that it is deeply moving to feel the understanding here on DFP. many of everyone's comments touched my own feelings about this. and this seems to encapsulate it all, so effectively:
the "hatred toward, Obama" - at the blogs i used to read - "just nauseates me. Plus, it annoys the hell out of me to see supposed adults acting like their fantasy world is the real world and I'm the one who doesn't 'get' it."

thank you, again.
all.

Thank you, nofurylike! While I can readily acknowledge that I don't always know the in's and out's of a particular issue, I do know it when my bullshit buzzer goes off, and it has been ringing off the wall since before Obama was nominated as the Democratic nominee. There are many people out there, though, that want to insist that I'm talking out of my hat, and I don't know what I actually know.

Reading what you wrote helps me feel like I'm still in the land of the sane!

[nofurylike]

(02-04-2011 03:35 AM)Punky Wrote:  Thank you, nofurylike! While I can readily acknowledge that I don't always know the in's and out's of a particular issue, I do know it when my bullshit buzzer goes off, and it has been ringing off the wall since before Obama was nominated as the Democratic nominee. There are many people out there, though, that want to insist that I'm talking out of my hat, and I don't know what I actually know.

Reading what you wrote helps me feel like I'm still in the land of the sane!

mmh! i am glad to hear that from you, Punky! that is what you gave me in this thread! land of the sane!!

those who are doing that to us have it easy. they've got the whole MSM, and the most ultra-privileged, all making them feel like they're right. it adds up to - honestly - horrifying self-righteousness shoved in our faces, and trying to block our way. so it can be exhausting, and often intensely emotional, to keep our heads above.
but you are doing it. we are. and DFP is a cherished sanctuary in which to do so!!

thanks, Punky!

[NJMaverick]

I have given this topic considerable thought. It's not the extreme or closer to center a person's liberal ideology is. Rather I believe it's a problem with how rigid their ideology is. If one is too rigid in one's ideology, the less one has the ability to adapt to situations that were never anticipated by those that created an ideology. Plus ideology is a nice guiding factor, but it shouldn't be the ONLY guiding factor.

[SeattleGirl]

(02-04-2011 02:37 PM)NJMaverick Wrote:  I have given this topic considerable thought. It's not the extreme or closer to center a person's liberal ideology is. Rather I believe it's a problem with how rigid their ideology is. If one is too rigid in one's ideology, the less one has the ability to adapt to situations that were never anticipated by those that created an ideology. Plus ideology is a nice guiding factor, but it shouldn't be the ONLY guiding factor.

How right you are, Mav. There is nothing wrong with having ideals, but when they become solidified, they become a problem, imho. And yes, it shouldn't be the only guiding factor. That's what creates problems, regardless of where one falls on the political spectrum. It's an inability to see and/or accept that in the real world, that nothing and no one will ever fully and completely measure up to one's ideals. Those who are intractably rigid seem to lead miserable lives, and oftentimes want the rest of us to join in that misery.

[Willinois]

(02-04-2011 02:37 PM)NJMaverick Wrote:  I have given this topic considerable thought. It's not the extreme or closer to center a person's liberal ideology is. Rather I believe it's a problem with how rigid their ideology is. If one is too rigid in one's ideology, the less one has the ability to adapt to situations that were never anticipated by those that created an ideology. Plus ideology is a nice guiding factor, but it shouldn't be the ONLY guiding factor.

They come from the "divide and be conquered" left who believe that small progress is worse than no progress. Others on the list, like Marxists, are arrogant enough to believe that there's only one true path to change and they know better than everyone else what it is.

[Cha]

The only thing "flawed" is David fooking Swanson's professional leftist attitude to fatten his own coffers and not give a shyte for his country.

David Swanson and his ilk are despicable dangerous idiots.

[Peadar O Suileabhain]

Moany of these people are neither Democrats nor liberals. They are from the far, far left wing flaky fringe.

Let's go to the tape...

Jean Hay Bright: Ran against Olympia Snowe and received a grand total of 20% of the vote (Snowe won 74%). Has since left the Democratic Party.

Glen Ford: A malcontent with a personal axe to grind with Obama. He has been badmouthing him since BHO's state senate days.

Medea Benjamin: Ran for Senate on the Green Party ticket in 2000; won a whopping 3% of the vote. Admits to having voted for Nader over Gore. Outspoken supporter of Castro and Chavez.

Monica Gabrielle: 9/11 widow who has played footsie with the Troofers.

Michelle Gross: Anti-police brutality activist who flew off the rails, comparing St. Paul police to "Nazis" and accusing the government of burglarizing her house.

Cynthia McKinney: Screwball extraordinairre.

Jeffrey St. Clair: Publisher of CounterPunch, which provides a platform for paleocon and libertarian isolationists, a place so fucked up even Skinner banned it from DU.

Marcy Winograd: Challenged Jane Harman in Democratic congressional primary, trounced by a 2 to 1 margin.

Alison Weir: President, Council for the National Interest. Her organization's staff and board has expressed support for Hamas and Hezbollah, and have attended conferences organized by a Holocaust denial group.

Joel Kovel: Author of "Overcoming Zionism"; the Michigan chapters of the American Jewish Congress, the Jewish Community Relations Council, and B'nai Brith, issued a statement describing Kovel's book as "often anti-Semitic in nature." The University of Michigan Press agreed, and has terminated its relationship with Kovel.

[Willinois]

(02-04-2011 03:02 PM)Peadar O Suileabhain Wrote:  Michelle Gross: Anti-police brutality activist who flew off the rails, comparing St. Paul police to "Nazis" and accusing the government of burglarizing her house.

To be fair, the events around the St. Paul Republican convention are the closest this nation has come in modern times to being a fascist police state. Home burglary would be in keeping with other actions taken at the time. It's a shame that no one in authority was prosecuted for abuse of power and that the media devoted so little coverage to a tragic episode in American history.

[SeattleGirl]

Wow, thanks for the info, Peadar! A rogue's gallery for sure!