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***NJMaverick*** · 01-10-2011, 02:33 PM

If I had my druthers I would point the finger at the right where it belongs. However, my ultimate goal is to end the violent rhetoric. So if people say they both do it and demand that it stops, I don't argue I join in demanding the end of dangerous language. I will certainly offer up all my examples of the right wingers doing it, but I am not going to let people dismiss me as a partisan playing partisan politics. I want to violence and danger to end.

**jaxx** · 01-10-2011, 02:46 PM

I am on that same avenue about the heated rhetoric. It has got to stop. I understand why people are so angry about what happened, we all are. But adding to the frenzy isn't going to make it better, it just keeps it fired up. I respect others rights to say what they will, but I am trying to keep it down on my end.

Peace.

**Andy823** · 01-10-2011, 03:49 PM

(01-10-2011 02:33 PM)NJMaverick Wrote: If I had my druthers I would point the finger at the right where it belongs. However, my ultimate goal is to end the violent rhetoric. So if people say they both do it and demand that it stops, I don't argue I join in demanding the end of dangerous language. I will certainly offer up all my examples of the right wingers doing it, but I am not going to let people dismiss me as a partisan playing partisan politics. I want to violence and danger to end.

Yes we all have to do our share to try and stop this madness. It isn't easy, but it takes two to start a fight, and two to end it! I too would rather put the blame where it belongs, but in the end it will take leaders on both sides to get involved. It is all about politics, and that makes it even harder to fix, but sure hope we can stop the hate mongers from continuing in there madness!

**Beetwasher** · 01-10-2011, 04:01 PM

(01-10-2011 02:33 PM)NJMaverick Wrote: If I had my druthers I would point the finger at the right where it belongs. However, my ultimate goal is to end the violent rhetoric. So if people say they both do it and demand that it stops, I don't argue I join in demanding the end of dangerous language. I will certainly offer up all my examples of the right wingers doing it, but I am not going to let people dismiss me as a partisan playing partisan politics. I want to violence and danger to end.

I understand where you're coming from, and I understand why it's probably a good idea for people in positions of power, responsibility and notoriety to take that approach. But it's just not in my make up. I have little tolerance for bullshit and frankly I'm just too much of an asshole.

**Velleity** · 01-10-2011, 04:32 PM

(01-10-2011 02:33 PM)NJMaverick Wrote: If I had my druthers I would point the finger at the right where it belongs. However, my ultimate goal is to end the violent rhetoric. So if people say they both do it and demand that it stops, I don't argue I join in demanding the end of dangerous language. I will certainly offer up all my examples of the right wingers doing it, but I am not going to let people dismiss me as a partisan playing partisan politics. I want to violence and danger to end.

It's two separate issues as far as I am concerned. To the extent we do it, it's just as wrong as when they do it but it's not connected. If we do it that in no way mitigates their behavior. Two wrongs don't make a right.

**KonaKane** · 01-10-2011, 04:38 PM

(01-10-2011 02:33 PM)NJMaverick Wrote: If I had my druthers I would point the finger at the right where it belongs. However, my ultimate goal is to end the violent rhetoric. So if people say they both do it and demand that it stops, I don't argue I join in demanding the end of dangerous language. I will certainly offer up all my examples of the right wingers doing it, but I am not going to let people dismiss me as a partisan playing partisan politics. I want to violence and danger to end.

It won't end on their part, and I suspect you know this. Why? Because it is ingrained into their "political DNA" for lack of a better term. In the right wing mind, the ultimate and best solution to affect change is for the violent elimination of your opposition. Period.

The best we can do is to loudly advocate for their legal containment as much as possible. Try to use the law, and our better arguments to hem in the worst of them. But please, don't allow yourself to fall to the illusion that they can be reasoned or guilted away from this part of their dirty underbelly.

**Velleity** · 01-10-2011, 04:45 PM

(01-10-2011 04:38 PM)KonaKane Wrote: It won't end on their part, and I suspect you know this. Why? Because it is ingrained into their "political DNA" for lack of a better term. In the right wing mind, the ultimate and best solution to affect change is for the violent elimination of your opposition. Period.

This is exactly correct. They are reactionaries and they are nothing without something to rub up against. At the base of their ideology is hate of something. They hate "commies." They hate "socialists". They hate immigrants. For some reason (thankfully, at the moment) they don't hate Jews, but brown skinned people remains another issue.

But most of all they hate "Liberal", and like Goebels (who said "we decide who is Jewish") they decide who is "Liberal".

Quote:The best we can do is to loudly advocate for their legal containment as much as possible. Try to use the law, and our better arguments to hem in the worst of them. But please, don't allow yourself to fall to the illusion that they can be reasoned or guilted away from this part of their dirty underbelly.

Indeed. If one allows him or herself to fall to the illusion that they can be reasoned or guilted away, one falls into their fraud. They are malicious. They will never negotiate in good faith because they believe we're evil.

The only hope is that the current batch dies off and a less malicious version evolves.

***NJMaverick*** · 01-10-2011, 04:57 PM

(01-10-2011 04:38 PM)KonaKane Wrote:
(01-10-2011 02:33 PM)NJMaverick Wrote: If I had my druthers I would point the finger at the right where it belongs. However, my ultimate goal is to end the violent rhetoric. So if people say they both do it and demand that it stops, I don't argue I join in demanding the end of dangerous language. I will certainly offer up all my examples of the right wingers doing it, but I am not going to let people dismiss me as a partisan playing partisan politics. I want to violence and danger to end.

It won't end on their part, and I suspect you know this. Why? Because it is ingrained into their "political DNA" for lack of a better term. In the right wing mind, the ultimate and best solution to affect change is for the violent elimination of your opposition. Period.

The best we can do is to loudly advocate for their legal containment as much as possible. Try to use the law, and our better arguments to hem in the worst of them. But please, don't allow yourself to fall to the illusion that they can be reasoned or guilted away from this part of their dirty underbelly.

If you look at things politically, this would still work out in our favor. Let them claim both sides are doing it and then demand that they stop while agreeing to stop ourselves. At that point, our side would have to change nothing, but they will have a devil of a time trying to stop and being called out every time they slip up.

**Velleity** · 01-10-2011, 05:02 PM

(01-10-2011 04:57 PM)NJMaverick Wrote: If you look at things politically, this would still work out in our favor. Let them claim both sides are doing it and then demand that they stop while agreeing to stop ourselves. At that point, our side would have to change nothing, but they will have a devil of a time trying to stop and being called out every time they slip up.

If they acted in good faith you would be right. But they don't.

**Andy823** · 01-10-2011, 05:52 PM

Quote:If you look at things politically, this would still work out in our favor. Let them claim both sides are doing it and then demand that they stop while agreeing to stop ourselves. At that point, our side would have to change nothing, but they will have a devil of a time trying to stop and being called out every time they slip up.

I totally agree. Put the ball in "their" court and make them do something, or as you said, be called out on it if they do not! If democrats agree to put a stop to on their side, then that puts the republicans in a corner. They have to go along with the democrats or come off looking like they could care less. Since our side has no talk show hosts spewing hate and inciting violence day after day, we don't really have to do anything.

Saje3d · 01-10-2011, 04:55 PM

Right, because they've always responded well to capitulation and appeasement in the past.

Okay. Not so much.

I'm not sure anyone has the right to ask me to stop calling them sociopaths as long as they keep acting like they are. But, then again, mileage will vary.

***azmouse*** · 01-10-2011, 07:16 PM

This idea might work if the spewers of this hate speech had any shame.

They don't.

**Velleity** · 01-10-2011, 09:04 PM

(01-10-2011 07:16 PM)azmouse Wrote: This idea might work if the spewers of this hate speech had any shame.

They don't.

No good faith and no shame. They lie.

**jaxx** · 01-11-2011, 07:22 AM

I am waiting for the one republican to step forward and condemn the actions that fire up the masses. Who will have the courage to take the wrath of their peers? No one? So it seems.

**JuniperLea** · 01-13-2011, 03:00 PM

I’ve heard some apologies from leftie radio types, and excuses and finger pointing from the righties. That speaks volumes. We need to continue to shine the hot white light of civility and truth on every vile, hatemongering comment we see, wherever we see it. We don’t need to buy into the finger pointing argument at all in order to do that. When you condemn all hate speak, you condemn all of it. They cannot deny their words. They are trying to pretend that words don’t matter. They say the left has “jumped” on this… uh, no. Many of us have been holding our breath waiting for this to happen, and it has. We have been so keenly tuned to their negative rhetoric that we know their shtick by heart. We didn’t need to jump on it, we were already there… and we’ve been there for a very long time.