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***NJMaverick*** · 04-08-2012, 06:16 AM

Quote:A new poll gauging Mississippi Republicans' preferences going into the 2012 election ended up revealing something more startling: 46 percent of GOP voters in the state think interracial marriage should be illegal.

Results were announced Thursday by Public Policy Polling, a polling firm based in North Carolina. The company asked 400 Republican primary voters about their preferences for candidates for state and national offices, as well as their views on interracial marriage.

A whopping 46 percent of likely GOP primary voters said they think interracial marriage should be illegal, while only 40 percent said they think it should be allowed. Another 14 percent said they were unsure.

It was only 45 years ago that Mississippi legalized interracial marriage, and this poll indicates it continues to be a controversial subject.

http://www.aolnews.com/2011/04/08/46-per...-marriage/

***There Is No Spoon*** · 04-08-2012, 08:15 AM

Then:

Now:

[Image: 1248287019-0722pod09.jpg?w=490&h=341]

**pappy** · 04-08-2012, 10:44 AM

(04-08-2012 08:15 AM)There Is No Spoon Wrote: Now:

To the guy in the "muscle shirt" - Dude, bad look. Put on sleeves!

**pappy** · 04-08-2012, 10:41 AM

Marrying your sister is still okay though!

***azmouse*** · 04-08-2012, 11:20 AM

(04-08-2012 10:41 AM)pappy Wrote: Marrying your sister is still okay though!

And don't forget the farm animals.

Of course, sister or farm animal, for some of these knuckle-dragging cretins it's probably the same thing.

**jaxx** · 04-08-2012, 12:57 PM

Sometimes I wonder if part of the south will ever come out of it's romance with discrimination. It's not pretty, it's not productive, it's only hateful. What gets to me is that they spend their lives teaching the next generation to hate too....spreading the ignorance. Babies aren't born intolerant, it's an acquired mindset taught at the knee of mama and daddy and grandparents who learned to hate people because of their color. It's a tradition that needs to be stopped....but how?

**OptimistesMaddie** · 04-08-2012, 10:09 PM

(04-08-2012 12:57 PM)jaxx Wrote: Sometimes I wonder if part of the south will ever come out of it's romance with discrimination. It's not pretty, it's not productive, it's only hateful. What gets to me is that they spend their lives teaching the next generation to hate too....spreading the ignorance. Babies aren't born intolerant, it's an acquired mindset taught at the knee of mama and daddy and grandparents who learned to hate people because of their color. It's a tradition that needs to be stopped....but how?

military when she graduated from hs. People have a choice, the problem is many of those people don't have the courage or the backbone to turn their backs to what they know is wrong.

I don't know how you teach courage, I think it is an internal thing that is just there. Some people have it and some people don't. I keep going back to Darwin's theory of "Survival of the fittest". The more I see the more I believe he was onto the truth....

**suzie** · (This post was last modified: 04-08-2012 05:43 PM by suzie.)

I have no love for Mississippi, but I wonder if the rest of the nation will ever take a look at itself and its own racism and stop just saying, "Oh those terrible racist Southerners."

As a liberal Southerner married to a liberal Southerner with a bunch of liberal Southerner friends, one starts to wonder, "Why should we even care?"

Why bother with Florida politics? Just let it go completely GOP and let Democrats in the rest of the country say, "Oh, those terrible Southerners", because that's what they'll say anyway.

Why spend one more minute of our time?

**sandnsea** · 04-09-2012, 02:57 AM

(04-08-2012 05:36 PM)suzie Wrote: I have no love for Mississippi, but I wonder if the rest of the nation will ever take a look at itself and its own racism and stop just saying, "Oh those terrible racist Southerners."

As a liberal Southerner married to a liberal Southerner with a bunch of liberal Southerner friends, one starts to wonder, "Why should we even care?"

Why bother with Florida politics? Just let it go completely GOP and let Democrats in the rest of the country say, "Oh, those terrible Southerners", because that's what they'll say anyway.

Why spend one more minute of our time?

Because if we don't recognize that 80% of the south Is Not liberal, then there's no way to help the Liberal Southerner to change the rest of them.

***azmouse*** · 04-09-2012, 09:13 AM

(04-08-2012 05:36 PM)suzie Wrote: I have no love for Mississippi, but I wonder if the rest of the nation will ever take a look at itself and its own racism and stop just saying, "Oh those terrible racist Southerners."

As a liberal Southerner married to a liberal Southerner with a bunch of liberal Southerner friends, one starts to wonder, "Why should we even care?"

Why bother with Florida politics? Just let it go completely GOP and let Democrats in the rest of the country say, "Oh, those terrible Southerners", because that's what they'll say anyway.

Why spend one more minute of our time?

I don't see this as a slam on ALL southerners, just the bigoted Repubicans who would turn back the clock on civil rights.

I live in AZ and hear these things about my state all the time. It's not the entirie state, it's just that we have a majority of RW Republicans who make the rest of us look bad.

**Treestar** · 04-08-2012, 05:54 PM

The only good news is that is less than 50% and it is Republicans. That could represent progress in that state.

**Brewman_Jax** · 04-08-2012, 07:50 PM

Really? You don't bring the slaves against their will, work them for free and get rich off of their labor, build a racist caste system that oppresses them and their descendants, and then complain that they still live there. Nono

I thought that they'd have more important things to worry about. Rolleyes

**janedrake** · 04-08-2012, 07:58 PM

100% of janedrake is disgusted by 46% of Mississippi Republicans.

**suzie** · 04-09-2012, 12:12 AM

Do any of you have the courage to live in the South and effect change daily? Or does it just work for you to say, "Oh those bad, bad Southerners?"

My spouse stayed in the South, ran for elected office because of an incident of racism that he saw happen to a young African American kid. Spent a career trying to help disadvantaged and disenfranchised kids.

Maybe in staying in the South and trying to change it, he was lacking in courage.

I don't think so, but then what do I know?

**suzie** · 04-09-2012, 08:29 AM

How exactly are you helping Liberal Southerners change "the rest of them"? Through your insistence that we're simply lacking in courage or good sense because we've remained in the South?

I lived in Washington, D.C. and watched Jimmy Carter maligned by liberals because he must be a racist--he was from The South. Didn't matter that he'd refused to join the White Citizens Council when he was first in business--he was still a Southerner. Couldn't match any of your Northern types who've never personally confronted that--but it didn't matter.

I once visited a kid in a detention center in that bastion of liberalism, San Francisco. The place was so old and such a firetrap that it scared me to even be there. I remarked to my husband, who'd presided over the renovation of a local detention center, that if this had been in The South, it'd be on the national news. As it was, my friends explained to me why it was okay--because it was after all, California.

I never read any statement by any of you "Liberal Blue State" folks that indicates you grasp the impact of Northern Republicans who've relocated to The South and vote a totally Republican ticket. My Southern relatives, many of them Republicans, all voted for Obama in 2008. I can assure you that the relocated Northerners in my community did not. In fact, the only Rick Scott sign on my street in 2010 was at the household of folks from Ohio. Rick himself is also from the Midwest.

But, by all means, overlook those stellar liberal legislators from Blue States that are in the national news--Issa, Ryan, Walker, Grassley, Walsh.

Maybe you should all just write off Florida, Virginia, North Carolina--because you don't want votes out of those racist states. Focus on such bastions of liberalism as Arizona, Kansas, Nebraska, Missouri, the Dakotas, Montana, Utah, Idaho, Indiana. I'm sure you can get those states to vote Democratic--and there are no racists who reside in any of them--unlike The South.

As for me, you've all convinced me, I'm resigning today from being a local official in the Democratic Party. All of y'all are correct--just let the South go.

***NJMaverick*** · 04-09-2012, 09:28 AM

(04-09-2012 08:29 AM)suzie Wrote: How exactly are you helping Liberal Southerners change "the rest of them"? Through your insistence that we're simply lacking in courage or good sense because we've remained in the South?

I lived in Washington, D.C. and watched Jimmy Carter maligned by liberals because he must be a racist--he was from The South. Didn't matter that he'd refused to join the White Citizens Council when he was first in business--he was still a Southerner. Couldn't match any of your Northern types who've never personally confronted that--but it didn't matter.

I once visited a kid in a detention center in that bastion of liberalism, San Francisco. The place was so old and such a firetrap that it scared me to even be there. I remarked to my husband, who'd presided over the renovation of a local detention center, that if this had been in The South, it'd be on the national news. As it was, my friends explained to me why it was okay--because it was after all, California.

I never read any statement by any of you "Liberal Blue State" folks that indicates you grasp the impact of Northern Republicans who've relocated to The South and vote a totally Republican ticket. My Southern relatives, many of them Republicans, all voted for Obama in 2008. I can assure you that the relocated Northerners in my community did not. In fact, the only Rick Scott sign on my street in 2010 was at the household of folks from Ohio. Rick himself is also from the Midwest.

But, by all means, overlook those stellar liberal legislators from Blue States that are in the national news--Issa, Ryan, Walker, Grassley, Walsh.

Maybe you should all just write off Florida, Virginia, North Carolina--because you don't want votes out of those racist states. Focus on such bastions of liberalism as Arizona, Kansas, Nebraska, Missouri, the Dakotas, Montana, Utah, Idaho, Indiana. I'm sure you can get those states to vote Democratic--and there are no racists who reside in any of them--unlike The South.

As for me, you've all convinced me, I'm resigning today from being a local official in the Democratic Party. All of y'all are correct--just let the South go.

Suzie,

Sometimes it's just easier to paint with broad bushes. It's also rather convenient to put people in arbitrary categories such as race, gender, religion, political party, political ideology, region of the Country, age, wealth and so on. If people really took the time to study, I think they would see it has more to do with the bible belt than the region being the southern half of the nation that generates the intolerance. I think it's safe to say socially conservative evangelical Protestantism is what drives the bulk of the racism and intolerance, not the fact that people live south of the Mason Dixon line.
It's also important to appreciate that majorities don't represent the views and opinions of everyone. It would be like someone from France saying America is a blood thirsty imperialist power because George Bush got his way and we invaded Iraq.
In the end though, there are good people in the South just as their are bad people in the north and west and everywhere. In fact owing to socially conservative evangelical Protestantism being less prevalent else where, bigotry tends to be practiced more in secret than in the other parts of the nation, but it doesn't mean it's not alive and well and a threat to our nation's morals and future.

**jaxx** · 04-09-2012, 09:37 AM

(04-09-2012 08:29 AM)suzie Wrote: How exactly are you helping Liberal Southerners change "the rest of them"? Through your insistence that we're simply lacking in courage or good sense because we've remained in the South?

I lived in Washington, D.C. and watched Jimmy Carter maligned by liberals because he must be a racist--he was from The South. Didn't matter that he'd refused to join the White Citizens Council when he was first in business--he was still a Southerner. Couldn't match any of your Northern types who've never personally confronted that--but it didn't matter.

I once visited a kid in a detention center in that bastion of liberalism, San Francisco. The place was so old and such a firetrap that it scared me to even be there. I remarked to my husband, who'd presided over the renovation of a local detention center, that if this had been in The South, it'd be on the national news. As it was, my friends explained to me why it was okay--because it was after all, California.

I never read any statement by any of you "Liberal Blue State" folks that indicates you grasp the impact of Northern Republicans who've relocated to The South and vote a totally Republican ticket. My Southern relatives, many of them Republicans, all voted for Obama in 2008. I can assure you that the relocated Northerners in my community did not. In fact, the only Rick Scott sign on my street in 2010 was at the household of folks from Ohio. Rick himself is also from the Midwest.

But, by all means, overlook those stellar liberal legislators from Blue States that are in the national news--Issa, Ryan, Walker, Grassley, Walsh.

Maybe you should all just write off Florida, Virginia, North Carolina--because you don't want votes out of those racist states. Focus on such bastions of liberalism as Arizona, Kansas, Nebraska, Missouri, the Dakotas, Montana, Utah, Idaho, Indiana. I'm sure you can get those states to vote Democratic--and there are no racists who reside in any of them--unlike The South.

As for me, you've all convinced me, I'm resigning today from being a local official in the Democratic Party. All of y'all are correct--just let the South go.

The article clearly, carefully points out:
"A new poll gauging Mississippi Republicans' preferences going into the 2012 election ended up revealing something more startling: 46 percent of GOP voters in the state think interracial marriage should be illegal."

Nowhere does it say southern liberals. I'm not seeing where you are coming from other than taking on that 46% of GOPs in Mississippi and equating them with liberals in the south. How do you give the GOP attitude to liberals?

**suzie** · (This post was last modified: 04-09-2012 10:07 AM by suzie.)

How many threads are there each week here about "racist Southerners" versus those about Arizonans?

"There's no way to help the Liberal Southerner change the rest of them...." Most of us have been fighting to change the South our whole lives.

What we really need is for some more outsiders to tell us that we just don't understand about "how un-liberal the South is."

As for everyone's sudden concern that it's only about "Mississippi Republicans". I believe that an article posted here last week pointed out that PPP doesn't even ask questions like the one about interracial marriage in primaries other than in The South.

If South Dakotans were queried about Native American children being better off with white families than in their own culture, I have little doubt about the results being rather awful. But that doesn't get asked, does it?

Because racism is only a problem in The South.

***azmouse*** · 04-09-2012, 09:55 AM

(04-09-2012 09:47 AM)suzie Wrote: How many threads are there each week here about "racist Southerners" versus those about Arizonans?

"There's no way to help the Liberal Southerner change the rest of them...." Most of us have been fighting to change the South our whole lives.

What we really need is for some more outsiders to tell us that we just don't understand about "how un-liberal the South is."

Stories about the horrors of AZ and its laws and politicians and bigotry are here on DFP pretty much every week.
I don't shy away from exposing the horrors of Republican rule so other Americans around the country know what they could be up against.

**jaxx** · 04-09-2012, 10:06 AM

(04-09-2012 09:55 AM)azmouse Wrote:
(04-09-2012 09:47 AM)suzie Wrote: How many threads are there each week here about "racist Southerners" versus those about Arizonans?

"There's no way to help the Liberal Southerner change the rest of them...." Most of us have been fighting to change the South our whole lives.

What we really need is for some more outsiders to tell us that we just don't understand about "how un-liberal the South is."

Stories about the horrors of AZ and its laws and politicians and bigotry are here on DFP pretty much every week.
I don't shy away from exposing the horrors of Republican rule so other Americans around the country know what they could be up against.

Chicago is a joke among the rightwing, we have 2 former governors in prison for corruption. The south side of Chicago, where PBO lived, is a hotbed of racial tensions. I don't try to hide it either, and I surely don't take it on as it's my fault as a liberal. It's a mess, and it's something we try to find a reasonable way to make better...for all the citizens.

**sandnsea** · 04-09-2012, 12:49 PM

(04-09-2012 09:55 AM)azmouse Wrote:
(04-09-2012 09:47 AM)suzie Wrote: How many threads are there each week here about "racist Southerners" versus those about Arizonans?

"There's no way to help the Liberal Southerner change the rest of them...." Most of us have been fighting to change the South our whole lives.

What we really need is for some more outsiders to tell us that we just don't understand about "how un-liberal the South is."

Stories about the horrors of AZ and its laws and politicians and bigotry are here on DFP pretty much every week.
I don't shy away from exposing the horrors of Republican rule so other Americans around the country know what they could be up against.

Maybe this map will help you understand why the interracial marriage question is asked in the south and not Arizona.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interracial...ted_States

**suzie** · (This post was last modified: 04-09-2012 11:40 AM by suzie.)

All of a sudden, everyone is concerned only about "Southern Republicans" in Mississippi.

But the author of the Altnernet article about misconceptions about the South notes that PPP doesn't ask questions about interracial marriage in other states, except South Carolina, or how Arizona or Colorado Republicans feel about hispanics:

"But liberal-leaning media can be particularly unhelpful when it comes to contextualizing lack of education in the South. She points out that Southerners are specifically polled with the kinds of questions – “How do you feel about interracial marriage?” “Do you believe in evolution?” – designed to confirm our collective ignorance. Of the recent polls on Alabama and Mississippi collected by North Carolina-based Public Policy Polling, for example, she says, “when I went back and looked through the rest of PPP’s polls from this year, I couldn’t find any other states that were asked about evolution. Ditto questions about whether Obama is a Muslim. And in only one other state did I see voters being asked about interracial marriage: South Carolina. (Surprise!).” Instead, she points out, other states were asked more predictable campaign year questions: Who do you support? Does a candidate’s electability figure prominently in your vote?

And yet she notes, “On the flip side, missing from this year’s polling were questions about how, say, Arizona or Colorado Republicans feel about Hispanics—immigration, unlike mixed-race couples, actually being a hot political potato. I mean, if we’re going to plumb voters’ innermost prejudices, why not dissect those likely to have real policy implications going forward?”

http://www.alternet.org/story/154794/5_b...29/?page=5

**suzie** · (This post was last modified: 04-09-2012 01:34 PM by suzie.)

So the laws were changed in 1967--how long ago is that, and yet you want the question to still be asked? For what purpose, other than just what you stated earlier in this thread, that we "liberal Southerners" just don't get how much we require the help of you liberal Blue Staters to understand what?

How stupid we are for not leaving THE SOUTH?

How un liberal we must be just by living in THE SOUTH?

How racist we must be, unlike liberals in the rest of the country because we live in THE SOUTH, where they once had laws against miscenegation?

Fine, every time I receive a phone call from the Obama campaign, a request for money, from now on, I'll be saying, "Forget it. Ask those liberals in the Blue States of Idaho, Utah, Kansas, Montana, The Dakotas, Wyoming for a contribution."

Because you've convinced me--I am officially done with Democrats.

Enjoy your precious feelings of superiority and work real hard on getting those northern states next to yours, Idaho, Nevada, Montana, into the Blue Column.

Because frankly, my dear, I no longer give a damn whether we terrible old racist types in Florida vote Democratic.

Those of you who are SOOOOOO SUPERIOR to us undoubtedly racist Southern liberals can just make up those electoral votes somewhere else.

Because it's certainly understandable why, in view of the laws CURRENTLY being passed in Arizona that foment racism, it's more important to ask about laws from FORTY YEARS AGO in The South.

Got it.

For those of you who told their own story about dealing with their own communities, thank you.

***There Is No Spoon*** · 04-09-2012, 01:32 PM

(04-09-2012 01:19 PM)suzie Wrote: So the laws were changed in 1967--how long ago is that, and yet you want the question to still be asked? For what purpose, other than just what you stated earlier in this thread, that we "liberal Southerners" just don't get how much we require the help of you liberal Blue Staters to understand what?

How stupid we are for not leaving THE SOUTH?

How un liberal we must be just by living in THE SOUTH?

How racist we must be, unlike liberals in the rest of the country because we live in THE SOUTH, where they once had laws against miscenegation?

Fine, every time I receive a phone call from the Obama campaign, a request for money, from now on, I'll be saying, "Forget it. Ask those liberals in the Blue States of Idaho, Utah, Kansas, Montana, The Dakotas, Wyoming for a contribution."

Because you've convinced me--I am officially done with Democrats.

Enjoy your precious feelings of superiority and work real hard on getting those northern states next to yours, Idaho, Nevada, Montana, into the Blue Column.

Because frankly, my dear, I no longer give a damn whether we terrible old racist types in Florida vote Democratic.

Those of you who are SOOOOOO SUPERIOR to us undoubtedly racist Southern liberals can just make up those electoral votes somewhere else.

Because it's certainly understandable why, in view of the laws CURRENTLY being passed in Arizona that foment racism, it's more important to ask about laws from FORTY YEARS AGO in The South.

Got it.

Biggest. Overreaction. Ever.

**suzie** · (This post was last modified: 04-09-2012 01:55 PM by suzie.)

Being told that, as Southerners, we should still be shamed and accept that it's just our lot to be asked about laws from 40 years ago?

But, Arizonans should not be asked about passing racist laws TODAY?

Yeah, I thought that was a bit of an overreaction.

**sandnsea** · 04-09-2012, 02:02 PM

(04-09-2012 01:40 PM)suzie Wrote: Being told that, as Southerners, we should still be shamed and accept that it's just our lot to be asked about laws from 40 years ago?

But, Arizonans should not be asked about passing racist laws TODAY?

Yeah, I thought that was a bit of an overreaction.

They ARE. My god. This is why I left the south. Keep it. Love it. Die in the ignorance. I don't give a shit.

***There Is No Spoon*** · 04-09-2012, 02:04 PM

(04-09-2012 01:40 PM)suzie Wrote: Being told that, as Southerners, we should still be shamed and accept that it's just our lot to be asked about laws from 40 years ago?

But, Arizonans should not be asked about passing racist laws TODAY?

Yeah, I thought that was a bit of an overreaction.

None of these ridiculous laws and attitudes should exist. I think the WMR in the South are TRYING to drive out all liberals and minorities so they can have the place to themselves, that's what I think. It amazes me how successful they are considering the number of women and minorities that live there. How do we fix this before they drive everybody out and declare victory or go nuts and start another civil war?

**sandnsea** · 04-09-2012, 02:10 PM

(04-09-2012 01:40 PM)suzie Wrote: Being told that, as Southerners, we should still be shamed and accept that it's just our lot to be asked about laws from 40 years ago?

But, Arizonans should not be asked about passing racist laws TODAY?

Yeah, I thought that was a bit of an overreaction.

Here, here's an interracial marriage poll asked of people all across the country. Happy now? Honestly, nobody in the south will change anything. Nobody outside of the south can say a word about the south. So just how in the damn hell is anything ever supposed to change????

http://www.gallup.com/poll/149390/record...iages.aspx

***There Is No Spoon*** · 04-09-2012, 02:25 PM

(04-09-2012 02:10 PM)sandnsea Wrote:
(04-09-2012 01:40 PM)suzie Wrote: Being told that, as Southerners, we should still be shamed and accept that it's just our lot to be asked about laws from 40 years ago?

But, Arizonans should not be asked about passing racist laws TODAY?

Yeah, I thought that was a bit of an overreaction.

Here, here's an interracial marriage poll asked of people all across the country. Happy now? Honestly, nobody in the south will change anything. Nobody outside of the south can say a word about the south. So just how in the damn hell is anything ever supposed to change????

http://www.gallup.com/poll/149390/record...iages.aspx

Quote:September 12, 2011
Record-High 86% Approve of Black-White Marriages
Ninety-six percent of blacks, 84% of whites approve

Holy crap - that's makes the result of this poll even more damning, if that were even possible!

IOW: 1 in 7 Americans disapprove of interracial marriage, but 1 in 2 Mississippians want it outlawed.

**KonaKane** · 04-09-2012, 02:32 PM

I give MAJOR props to suzie for being a liberal living in the Deep South. I have no concept about how horrid that would be right now. It would be easy for me, living in very likely the bluest state (Hawaii) to wag a finger at liberals in the South and ask them why the hell they are still living there. But I'm not going to do it.

And I'll tell you something else - you're not going to change a fucking thing by berating one of our own, living in the South, either.

***NJMaverick*** · 04-09-2012, 02:49 PM

this isn't like other political websites where you feel free to verbally abuse and treat others with a lack of respect. We are all Democrats and liberals and we certainly shouldn't be treating each other like we are some backward Republican or ignorant professional lefty. We are smarter and more mature than that. We appreciate being kind can be as important as trying to be right. We appreciate we all come from different backgrounds and have different perspectives. We all know the danger of painting people and places with broad strokes.

So take a deep breath, take a walk do whatever to calm down and gain perspective. We liberal Democrats have enough real enemies and threats, we certainly don't need to make things worse by fighting among ourselves.

**SeattleGirl** · 04-09-2012, 03:31 PM

(04-09-2012 02:49 PM)NJMaverick Wrote: this isn't like other political websites where you feel free to verbally abuse and treat others with a lack of respect. We are all Democrats and liberals and we certainly shouldn't be treating each other like we are some backward Republican or ignorant professional lefty. We are smarter and more mature than that. We appreciate being kind can be as important as trying to be right. We appreciate we all come from different backgrounds and have different perspectives. We all know the danger of painting people and places with broad strokes.

So take a deep breath, take a walk do whatever to calm down and gain perspective. We liberal Democrats have enough real enemies and threats, we certainly don't need to make things worse by fighting among ourselves.

I agree with you Mav. And suzie is right; not everybody who lives in the south is a Republican, not everybody who lives in the south is a racist, not everybody who lives in the south hates Obama. Yes, there are people like that there, but there are people like that all over this country.

**sandnsea** · 04-09-2012, 05:24 PM

(04-09-2012 02:49 PM)NJMaverick Wrote: this isn't like other political websites where you feel free to verbally abuse and treat others with a lack of respect. We are all Democrats and liberals and we certainly shouldn't be treating each other like we are some backward Republican or ignorant professional lefty. We are smarter and more mature than that. We appreciate being kind can be as important as trying to be right. We appreciate we all come from different backgrounds and have different perspectives. We all know the danger of painting people and places with broad strokes.

So take a deep breath, take a walk do whatever to calm down and gain perspective. We liberal Democrats have enough real enemies and threats, we certainly don't need to make things worse by fighting among ourselves.

I know. It's only okay when people do it to me.

**suzie** · (This post was last modified: 04-09-2012 02:54 PM by suzie.)

Y'all truly make me remember why the Obama campaign was so successful in Florida, as compared to the Kerry and other campaigns.

Because they sent people to work with the locals who'd actually been born and raised somewhere near. Who wouldn't say, "Omigod, you're all rednecks, racists and you talk so funny and I can't even get a good bagel or decent Phillie cheese steak and you don't really expect me to eat grits or catfish? Seriously?"

And who actually sounded like the rest of the local populace and didn't say, "Damn, I can't understand a word you guys say."

They sent young lawyers who were originally from Florida, who just contacted a bunch of retired lawyers to get them to work with their Supervisors of Elections. Who didn't say, "Well, what law school did you go to, some Southern one that's not very good?" Or, "Bet you've got the best judges money can buy around here."

Seemed real successful to me.

**sandnsea** · (This post was last modified: 04-09-2012 05:37 PM by sandnsea.)

This discussion seems quite familiar to the abuser who insists nobody get angry at him for being an abuser - and calls the abused spouse crazy when she reacts sensibly - which does mean anger and a defined list of the abuse. The family members who stand by the abuser are called enablers.

Just so everybody understands what is going on here. And by here I mean this country, not this discussion.

**KonaKane** · 04-09-2012, 09:01 PM

SnS, this is going to harken back to another dust up we had awhile ago but I'd be less than honest if I just ignored it. There is a reason I made such a big stink about slamming people like Matt Damon and Michael Moore. When you fail to step back, look at the big picture and realize who your allies are, you do a disservice to yourself and those you ostensibly support. Know who shares your view of a better world - whether they agree with you on this little issue or that, or regardless of where they live.

**jaxx** · 04-10-2012, 07:41 AM

But it's ok when Michael Moore slams PBO. I got it.

I'll just shut up and go do what I want.

***There Is No Spoon*** · 04-10-2012, 07:45 AM

(04-10-2012 07:41 AM)jaxx Wrote: But it's ok when Michael Moore slams PBO. I got it.

I'll just shut up and go do what I want.

Oh, no, did Kona bring up you arch nemesis - Michael Moore - again? Facepalm

**jaxx** · 04-10-2012, 07:47 AM

(04-10-2012 07:45 AM)There Is No Spoon Wrote:
(04-10-2012 07:41 AM)jaxx Wrote: But it's ok when Michael Moore slams PBO. I got it.

I'll just shut up and go do what I want.

Oh, no, did Kona bring up you arch nemesis - Michael Moore - again?

You mean my buddy? When he goes astray I just hit him with a tweet. He knows when he's been bad.

***There Is No Spoon*** · 04-10-2012, 08:13 AM

(04-10-2012 07:47 AM)jaxx Wrote:
(04-10-2012 07:45 AM)There Is No Spoon Wrote: Oh, no, did Kona bring up you arch nemesis - Michael Moore - again?

You mean my buddy? When he goes astray I just hit him with a tweet. He knows when he's been bad.

jaxx to MM -> Spank

MM to computer -> Screen_of_death

**Peacetrain** · 04-10-2012, 08:17 AM

What a load of horse-hockey .. opposing marriage between the races..

You can have 10 people in a theater of 300 stampede the entire theater by yelling fire.

You get people in a state of fear.. you are not going to want your children to marry across the melatonin lines for their own safety..because you have those yahoos willing to do anything to keep what they perceptive as a purity of beige.

And you are going to see that in polls, and what people say and what they believe can be two very different things when they feel under siege.

Its the same thing for womens rights.. some of our own sat on their backsides in 2010 and let the rabid right take over countless state houses.. and now individual people do not know where it is safe to be.

So knowing there is a safe place for them to be the best person they can be.. God Bless the Liberals and Democrats in Mississippi that have to deal with that on a day to day basis.

Hang in their folks.. I have your back..

**Peacetrain** · 04-10-2012, 08:57 AM

(04-10-2012 08:17 AM)Peacetrain Wrote: What a load of horse-hockey .. opposing marriage between the races..

You can have 10 people in a theater of 300 stampede the entire theater by yelling fire.

You get people in a state of fear.. you are not going to want your children to marry across the melatonin lines for their own safety..because you have those yahoos willing to do anything to keep what they perceive as a purity of beige.

And you are going to see that in polls, and what people say and what they believe can be two very different things when they feel under siege.

Its the same thing for Women's rights.. some of our own sat on their backsides in 2010 and let the rabid right take over countless state houses.. and now individual people do not know where it is safe to be.

So knowing there is a safe place for them to be the best person they can be.. God Bless the Liberals and Democrats in Mississippi that have to deal with that on a day to day basis.

Hang in their folks.. I have your back..

Edit for spelling.. sheesh.. why do I never catch those the first time I write and re-read them..