Is there no one who is at least a centrist Democrat

[Blue_Roses]

in my past ...Good grief, I went on Facebook and I have never seen so many repubs and conservatives in my circle of "friends" as what I do now! I don't go on Facebook much and now I remember why!

Most of the so-called friends were high school and college buddies, so it stands to reason that we've "grown-up" some, but most of them appear to be stuck in a time warp.

...and thank-goodness I didn't end up with any old flames. One guy I had dated has a ton of just hunting pics...with another batch just of his hunting rifle. This was a guy I was crazy about at one time--years ago. He never even mentioned hunting, much less a rifle. What the hell happened to these people? It's like a cult...ugh..

[jaxx]

I think my second husband was a closet repub, which came out after the papers were signed.
We lasted 9 months. No way was I living with a dictator.

[KonaKane]

(12-21-2011 07:05 AM)Blue_Roses Wrote:  in my past ...Good grief, I went on Facebook and I have never seen so many repubs and conservatives in my circle of "friends" as what I do now! I don't go on Facebook much and now I remember why!

Most of the so-called friends were high school and college buddies, so it stands to reason that we've "grown-up" some, but most of them appear to be stuck in a time warp.

...and thank-goodness I didn't end up with any old flames. One guy I had dated has a ton of just hunting pics...with another batch just of his hunting rifle. This was a guy I was crazy about at one time--years ago. He never even mentioned hunting, much less a rifle. What the hell happened to these people? It's like a cult...ugh..

Not to sound trite here, but I think it is a truth that people tend to grow more conservative as they grow older. Conservative to them means preserving what it is they have, because they are in fact losing it. They look in the mirror and see themselves losing their youth. They have homes or property, and don't want to lose that. They watch their family maintenance, medical bills mount, their savings dwindle and they want to preserve that. They are alienated by a new youth culture they can't understand or are repulsed by in some ways, and want to conserve the world they remember in their "best" days which tend to be around high school. They feel the world they know and love slipping through their fingers and become conservatives mostly out of fear. Fear is the main motivator of modern conservatism in all of its forms.

Then there are those of us who keep evolving, keep discovering, keep learning, keep exploring, keep flowering. Conservatives cannot relate to that. I was fairly popular in high school, but I can tell you now that I have lost almost all of my friends from that era, ideologically. I am one of maybe three people in my graduating class who are still liberal/progressive - let alone centrist.

Sorry to say, you will most likely be one of the odd ones out as the years go on.

[RoyGBiv]

(12-21-2011 01:00 PM)KonaKane Wrote:  Not to sound trite here, but I think it is a truth that people tend to grow more conservative as they grow older.

I'm sure that is true, but what disturbs me the most is finding a friend I had in high school or early college and discovering they have turned into fundamentalist religious freaks. It seemed to happen in their late 20s for the most part, and I can't figure out the reason for it in most cases. Some are clearly trying to atone for their younger days, but most deny outright they were who they were before being "Born Again."

One guy and I came to virtual blows over it. He was the biggest womanizer and drunkard I ever met in high school and used to make my life hell because I didn't drink. (I'm one of those weird people who never even had a beer until they were of legal age.) I dated his girlfriend's sister, and she told me horror stories about the way he treated her ... not just typical teenage male BS but outright emotional and physical abuse. He "friended" me on Facebook a long time ago, and I finally just got tired of seeing all these bullshit lies he posted about how he never did this or that or the other thing and suggesting that people who did do those things needed to be in jail and locked away forever where they could repent and face God's judgement.

So I unleashed a stream of truth his way, and he actually threatened to sue me for libel. Problem was, there are police records.

Anyway, I quickly de-friended and blocked him after that. He's made several attempts since to re-engage me where he can find me because he just can't let it go.

He's the most dramatic example, but I've lost count of the number of people from my former life who keep trying to "save" me, some of whom only did so recently when they found out I intend to vote for Obama again. Hell, back then I was the designated driver and the one who kept them from killing themselves or other people, and they were the radical anarchists I thought were way too out there.

I loathe the hypocrisy.

[KonaKane]

(12-22-2011 04:17 AM)RoyGBiv Wrote:  I'm sure that is true, but what disturbs me the most is finding a friend I had in high school or early college and discovering they have turned into fundamentalist religious freaks. It seemed to happen in their late 20s for the most part, and I can't figure out the reason for it in most cases. Some are clearly trying to atone for their younger days, but most deny outright they were who they were before being "Born Again."

One guy and I came to virtual blows over it. He was the biggest womanizer and drunkard I ever met in high school and used to make my life hell because I didn't drink. (I'm one of those weird people who never even had a beer until they were of legal age.) I dated his girlfriend's sister, and she told me horror stories about the way he treated her ... not just typical teenage male BS but outright emotional and physical abuse. He "friended" me on Facebook a long time ago, and I finally just got tired of seeing all these bullshit lies he posted about how he never did this or that or the other thing and suggesting that people who did do those things needed to be in jail and locked away forever where they could repent and face God's judgement.

So I unleashed a stream of truth his way, and he actually threatened to sue me for libel. Problem was, there are police records.

Anyway, I quickly de-friended and blocked him after that. He's made several attempts since to re-engage me where he can find me because he just can't let it go.

He's the most dramatic example, but I've lost count of the number of people from my former life who keep trying to "save" me, some of whom only did so recently when they found out I intend to vote for Obama again. Hell, back then I was the designated driver and the one who kept them from killing themselves or other people, and they were the radical anarchists I thought were way too out there.

I loathe the hypocrisy.

I can completely relate to this, when it comes to the new found religious fervor in some of these people. I, also, had a close high school friend who sported shall we say some over the top Bohemian views and behaviors. Really fancied himself on the edge, even swapping his wife with friends in his first marriage. I lost contact with him for years, and like you finally relinked with him on Facebook a year ago. Well he has become quite the fire and brimstone ChristiUHNNNNNN, to the point of being obnoxious. He adores George W Bush and the Republicans, thinks Obama is a socialist Muslim yada yada....YET, he always posts these videos from bands back in his Bohemian days as if he somehow regrets the life he has now, and wishes it was 1979 for him again. He truly lives in the past, and hardly ever talks about anything besides what he did in the years 1978-1984. Outside of that he is caustic, narrow minded and extremely bigoted.

I'm willing to admit I don't know all of possible life dramas that lead someone to the fundamentalist path, but I really don't get why they would choose such a thing while still pining away for the wild days. Bizarre. Even a bit mentally disturbed, if you ask me.

[truebrit71]

(12-21-2011 01:00 PM)KonaKane Wrote:  [quote='Blue_Roses' pid='72826' dateline='1324472739']
iNot to sound trite here, but I think it is a truth that people tend to grow more conservative as they grow older.

Hehehehe I must have missed that memo...the older I get the more liberal/progressive I become...Maybe because I've accepted the fact that I can't take anything with me when i die so I might as well make things as pleasant for myself and those I care about, rather than focus on owning 'things'...

[KonaKane]

(12-22-2011 01:56 PM)truebrit71 Wrote:  Hehehehe I must have missed that memo...the older I get the more liberal/progressive I become...Maybe because I've accepted the fact that I can't take anything with me when i die so I might as well make things as pleasant for myself and those I care about, rather than focus on owning 'things'...

Well you certainly buck the trend, and that's not a bad thing.

[Treestar]

(12-22-2011 01:56 PM)truebrit71 Wrote:  

(12-21-2011 01:00 PM)KonaKane Wrote:  [quote='Blue_Roses' pid='72826' dateline='1324472739']
iNot to sound trite here, but I think it is a truth that people tend to grow more conservative as they grow older.

Hehehehe I must have missed that memo...the older I get the more liberal/progressive I become...Maybe because I've accepted the fact that I can't take anything with me when i die so I might as well make things as pleasant for myself and those I care about, rather than focus on owning 'things'...

I had read somewhere that women get more radical as they get older.

[sandnsea]

I don't know your race for certain, guessing white. 62% of whites are Republicans. 80% of white males are Republicans.

http://www.magazine.org/asme/magazine_aw...ire485.pdf

[There Is No Spoon]

There are times when it pays to live in the Northeast. There's lots of conservatives, but you can always find a "quiet" bunch who are liberal. I think because men have a tendency to swagger and many more men are Republicans, it tends to seem like there are more Republicans than there really are. One relatively quick way to shut them up is to give them a tight-lip and "move the conversation along" when they start on a rant. Less is often more for me, though I will get in their face right quick with rapid-fire facts if they insist on pushing their idiocy.

[cannae1]

I was RW - Goldwater - in high school. Then, I started to read and learn. In college, I read about left wing and right wing ( people like Marx and people like Burke, etc) Those extremes made no sense to me. Both extremes were illogical, unrealistic and non factual. I actually read and still read books.

I knew that life is unfair and deserve had nothing to do with it; that life is contingent and there were no guarantees that your plans would work out. The important things were: persist with the ability to find "plan B"; endurance; sense of humor. You do what you need to do, when you need to do it.
Practical/realistic liberalism makes sense to me. RW and LW doctrine does not. I believe such things as: tolerance is not a virtue; tolerance is a necessity. We have a Bill of Rights because we need a Bill of Rights.

Nowadays, most of the people that I know are faithful GOP. There are, also, people who think that it is rude to discuss politics or religion. So, I am, usually, spared rants.

[DFW]

I might come close to qualifying.

I don't know what exactly these days constitutes "centrist." I certainly don't believe in wholesale socialist economics where the state has complete ownership of the means of production. No incentive=no production. I lived next door to the nations of the Warsaw Pact for 10 years. I lived the French socialist "experiment" under Mitterand (to the extent that they got away with it). That didn't work out too well either. Any system that has to imprison it citizens does not work. On the other hand, unfettered libertarian capitalism doesn't work either. Oil companies and mining companies taking no responsibility for killing people or polluting oceans, Halliburton getting away with overcharging the country for services not rendered in Iraq, Diebold and ESS allowed to throw elections any way they want, banks allowed to bully a nation--these are crimes against the country that government must pursue, try and punish--heavily. Taxes need to be levied fairly and reasonably, and to the extent needed for the country's general health, welfare and safety, not to perpetuate unneeded bureaucracy and officials above the law (the TSA comes to mind). Religion MUST have no say in ANY aspect of government.

Is that centrist? Is a label even necessary?

[KonaKane]

You sound more like a "sensibilist".

[Ikonoklast]

One the brother of a friend, the other a classmate from high school...both of these guys, way back when, never found a party, a drug, a drink, a woman, or a fight they didn't like.

Now, one has a cable-access show promoting his narrow view of Christian hatred for all those who disagree with him, and the other is a preacher who writes letters to the editor decrying everything not Republican, Christian, White, or just like him.

It's as if they can find no balance in their lives, everything is full-tilt in one direction or the other, no middle ground, all extremes.

I don't get it.

Is it guilt, self-hatred, atonement for perceived sins?

[cannae1]

DFW, it sounds like we are in agreement.


ikonoclast, I have noticed that some people seem to go from one extreme to another. When they stop doing or saying one extreme, they go to the opposite ( maybe the opposite is not as opposite as it appears).

[KonaKane]

Had a friend who went through AA once, tell me that lots of folks simply exchange drugs (dependencies)....booze for Jesus.

[RoyGBiv]

(12-25-2011 12:10 PM)KonaKane Wrote:  Had a friend who went through AA once, tell me that lots of folks simply exchange drugs (dependencies)....booze for Jesus.

I have a friend who has been through AA recently, and he's had a BIZARRE experience. He's a heavily addictive personality. He always has some "drug" he's addicted to. He finally got help for himself after waking up in a really bad part of DC, on the street, vomit dripping from his chin, not knowing how he got there, people throwing him change. AA has done good things for him as far as the alcohol is concerned, but he did in fact exchange that drug for another. In his case, though, it is what I call militant atheism. (I've seen it categorized elsewhere as "spade atheism.")

One of my main problems with fundamentalist religions is their proselytizing. Well, I don't like proselytizing from anyone, and what he does is take the kind of thing you hear from a fire-and-brimstone preacher in a mega church and simply inserts atheism. Everything he talks about has an atheist angle to it that he has to push at you until you either damn well agree with him or just tune out. It's completely annoying.

This was a horrible thing to say to an alcoholic, but he got on my nerves so badly one day that I actually told him I could tolerate him better when he was drinking. At least then he passed out and shut up eventually. (I did apologize later, but still.)

[KonaKane]

Oy. The militant atheist fundamentalist. I can totally relate to the revulsion of that one.

[Drunken Irishman]

My entire family has been Democratic since I can remember. My grandparents were Democrats and their parents Democrats. All my grandma's sisters and brothers were Democrats (grandpa was an only child).

So, my mom and her sisters were raised in a very Democratic household. Grandpa was a teacher, Grandma a social worker, so employment in the public sector.

My mom and two of my aunts remain Democrats to this day and are fairly liberal.

One of my aunts left home, moved to Texas, left the Catholic faith, became a Methodist and a right-wing Republican.

:/

[Treestar]

Maybe due to living in a blue state, but most of the high school people seem to be liberals.

A few religious nuts - I can ignore them pretty easily.

[KonaKane]

Oddly enough, the vast majority of the fabulously rich folks I know who live here on the West Coast of the Big Island (and you have to be fabulously rich to live a six bedroom house here) are liberal Democrats. Some even regular protestors downtown to support OWS, strange as that sounds. But then again, this is probably the Blue-est state.

Addendum: The locals I know most hostile to liberals and the OWS are middle class wage earners, believing they are soon to be the fabulously wealthy.